Its official, Calgary and Carolina will share Lowell

[moonstomper]

Flames to share AHL team with Carolina

TSN.ca Staff

5/20/2003

Calgary, AB - Calgary Flames General Manager & Head Coach Darryl Sutter announced today an agreement has been reached with the Carolina Hurricanes that will see the Flames development program be shared with Carolina's American Hockey League franchise in Lowell, MA.

"We are pleased to have secured an agreement with Carolina that will allow for the continued development of our top prospects in the American Hockey League," said Sutter. "Both Calgary and Carolina have the same needs and goal of creating a highly competitive environment in Lowell. This agreement also allows us to keep our prospects, including a goaltender, together. Both of these factors were considered critical for the development of our players. I look forward to our relationship with Jim Rutherford and the Carolina Hurricanes."

The agreement permits Calgary to place nine players, consisting of one goaltender and eight skaters, with the Lowell Lock Monsters during the 2003-2004 season. Flames development and goaltender coaches, through scheduled assignments in Lowell, will scout and provide instruction to Flames' prospects, overseeing their growth and development.

Flames President and Chief Executive Officer Ken King added: "This move is consistent with our overall player development strategy that includes the ultimate permanent relocation of our American Hockey League franchise."

Calgary placed their American Hockey League franchise, operated in Saint John, New Brunswick for the past 10 years, in dormancy for the 2003-2004 season

[Jeff O Rocks]

so are their nine players available to the Canes and vice versa? :roll:

[moonstomper]

Nope, it just means things are gonna be quite cramped in the locker room, I dont know how this can be good for us, besides making Lowell more competitive, how will OUR prospects get the playing time they need to develop?

Does this mean we have to send 9 players to Florida? and I wonder what happens to the rest of the St. Johns Flames?

[Tatfever]

We had this same problem up here in Lowell one time. We had the Kings and Islanders prospects. More Kings than Islanders. One of the scouts for the Islanders felt that one of their players was not getting enough playing time and complained to Mike Milbury.
Next thing we knew, they took all the Islander prospects out of Lowell and scattered them throughout the AHL. It was probably one of the craziest times we ever saw here in Lowell.

[Tatfever]

I was looking forward to seeing Zepp and Petruk up here this year. Now I guess it will be one of them and Szuper. I wonder how Carolina will do this and decide which one to keep up here.

[Turbulence]

There are so many pros and cons to this move...
We need Lowell to be successful for our guys to experience success. Adding the top prospects from any team, especially Calgary, can only lead to better success...or so it seems. You can get many of the riffs that Tat talked about...equality among players can lead to troubles. Both sets of prospects will go through a different mini-camp....how will that affect team chemistry upon the time they all convene in Lowell?
I honestly don't know what to think. This has the potential to help both NHL clubs, Lowell, and the Everblades....but it could not. Only time will tell, I suppose.

[Tatfever]

I am not sure what to think either, due to the fact of what happened last time we had two teams here.
One quote that made no sense to me was that both teams play a similar style of hockey. The St. John Flames played a much nastier type of game than Lowell.
With Ron Smith still being here :sad: , I am not sure how this will play out. He is not one to have the team play with an edge. That is the only way I have seen the Flames play the last 5 years. Should be interesting to watch.

[tommy]

I agree with the negative points that people have brought up here. This might help Lowell a small amount, but I really don't know why this had to happen. :roll:

[nccanes]

There's a dual thread in the Canes forum. I guess it probably belongs there as much as here, but I'll post this here and let the mods sort it out :)

From the Naples News:

ECHL: New deal could benefit Blades
Wednesday, May 21, 2003
By ANDY KENT, ankent@naplesnews.com

A new agreement reached Tuesday between the NHL's Carolina Hurricanes and Calgary Flames stands to have a significant impact on the ECHL's Florida Everblades.

Carolina and Calgary will now share the Hurricanes' American Hockey League affiliate in Lowell, Mass., with the Flames providing eight skaters and one goaltender for the Lock Monsters next season.

"The good thing is Carolina has signed a lot of guys, which means we might get more pros pects here than in the past," Everblades head coach Gerry Fleming said. "but if Carolina and Calgary both get hit with injuries then we could lose more. There are positives and negatives."

Next season will be the third that the Hurricanes have sent their top prospects to play for the Lock Monsters, supplying the entire roster the last two years. Calgary placed its AHL franchise, operated in Saint John, New Brunswick, for the past 10 years, in dormancy for the 2003-04 season.

"This should help create a highly competitive environment in Lowell next season, which is critical for the development of our top prospects," said Hurricanes vice president/ assistant general manager Jason Karmanos in a press release. "When two teams share an affiliate, the combination of their top prospects usually leads to a stronger team on the ice."

Lowell finished the 2002-03 campaign with the worst record in the AHL, as did Carolina in the NHL. All three AHL teams that were shared by two NHL parent clubs — Hamilton, Springfield and Utah — qualified for the 2003 Calder Cup Playoffs.

The Lock Monsters will again be coached by Ron Smith, assisted by Tom Rowe.



From the Calgary Sun:

Monster mash
Baby Flames find new home by joining with 'Canes club
By JEAN LEFEBVRE, Calgary Sun


Having found a home for his orphaned prospects, Darryl Sutter will now get to work on tuning up his management team.

A little more than a month after adding the GM's docket to his coaching duties, Sutter has detected flaws in the Flames' support system.

"I think there probably are going to be changes in our scouting staff," Sutter said yesterday. "Whether that's additions and/or deletions, that's something I still have to work through.

"The bottom line is I'm trying to put together the best scouting staff in the National Hockey League because that's really, really important in this market -- to draft and develop players -- and I'm not sure we've accomplished that well enough."

Even if no one gets fired or hired, Sutter will at least alter the way Calgary goes about its scouting business.

"We probably need more guys in place on the pro side who are actually on the road," he explained, "and we have to regionalize our amateur personnel. I need to do all that before I do anything else."

That means the hiring of an assistant GM will wait.

"I think the definition of roles to provide the pro scouting and the amateur scouting may be more significant than that actual position itself right now," suggested Sutter. "As for the timetable of (hiring an assistant GM), it's not as important as the draft to be quite honest."

Sutter's summer to-do list is one item shorter as of yesterday as the Flames announced an agreement to place eight skaters and a goaltender with the Carolina Hurricanes' American Hockey League farm team in Lowell, Mass.

Calgary's AHL affiliate in Saint John was mothballed last month after the Flames bought out the red ink-oozing club's local ownership.

Sutter had discussions with five NHL clubs about a shared relationship and determined the Hurricanes were the best fit.

"It washes really good for us," said Sutter. "This is a really good situation.

"This is a deal that works for Carolina because they were in a position also where they didn't feel it was necessary to go out and sign 10 more pros (to stock an AHL team) and that's exactly what we felt also."

Sutter figures a full affiliate is unnecessary and wasteful.

"The past two years in Saint John, there's been 20-plus players under NHL contracts and only two or three of them have been able to move and play in the National Hockey League."

The Flames' top prospects now have a place to play and Lowell can certainly use the help -- the Loch Monsters were an AHL-worst 19-51-7-3 and their offence was last with 175 goals in 80 games.

During the month of March, the Hurricanes organization was so light in manpower that left winger Tomas Kurka shuttled between Carolina and Lowell 10 times to ensure both teams could ice a full lineup.

The Baby Flames had their own problems -- they finished in the Canadian Division cellar with a 32-41-6-1 mark.

The Loch Monsters will be coached by a Hurricanes-appointed staff -- led by former New York Rangers head coach and long-time Canucks assistant Ron Smith -- but Calgary personnel has full access.

Carolina brass was concerned about the effects of the Loch Monsters' chronic losing.

"This should help create a highly competitive environment in Lowell next season," said 'Canes vice-president and assistant GM Jason Karmanos, "which is critical for the development of our top prospects."

"Part of developing players is a winning environment -- no question," nodded Sutter.

The Calgary GM wouldn't reveal the financial details of the arrangement but emphasized the Flames and Hurricanes are not splitting the costs down the middle.

Calgary will continue to have a secondary affiliate in Johnstown of the East Coast Hockey League.

[crazy4canes]

I'm moving this to Hurricanes Discussion.

[Cool Hand Luke]

After reading the Calgary article, this just seems like another cost cutting move.

"This is a deal that works for Carolina because they were in a position also where they didn't feel it was necessary to go out and sign 10 more pros (to stock an AHL team) and that's exactly what we felt also."

I tend to have a negative feeling towards this deal. It really kills our potential goalie development more than anything, especially if Irbe is playing in Lowell. We really need to buy out Mr. irbe, or none of our goalie prospects will be getting any worthwhile playing time in AHL level competition. It's not doing the organization any good at all to have Irbe in Lowell. If they don't buy him out, I'm going to be extremely disappointed.

[mikus]

does that mean calgary can call up irbe?

[moonstomper]

does that mean calgary can call up irbe?

as far as I know, no. Each team will still have the exclusive rights to their players

[mikus]

does that mean calgary can call up irbe?

as far as I know, no. Each team will still have the exclusive rights to their players
that's a pity...

[StormShaman]

Each team will still have the exclusive rights to their players

You are correct sir.

[1Irbegirlforever]

does that mean calgary can call up irbe?

as far as I know, no. Each team will still have the exclusive rights to their players
that's a pity...

I almost wish they could...maybe all Archie needs is a fresh start somewhere other than Carolina...too much bad blood here for him to feel comfortable i'm afraid. i just dread thinking he may not play in the nhl again.

[CaniacPanther]

This was not a good decision at all by the management. We won't have as much room to put our prospects now with Calgary's players filling the roster. Furthermore, our players will be developing a chemistry with Calgary's guys instead of our own...which will obviously not help our guys work together once they are called up. I'm sorry, but this is not the way to rebuild a team.

[Stormbringer]

Regarding this situation, I'm very much an advocate of "Let's wait and see what happens...". I read an interesting observation somewhere that a good chunk of the teams competing in the playoffs in the AHL were teams shared by two or more NHL teams. With that said, I think it is best to see how it works for one season...though, I do agree that something should be done about Irbe.

[CaniacPanther]

I read an interesting observation somewhere that a good chunk of the teams competing in the playoffs in the AHL were teams shared by two or more NHL teams.

This may be true, but the AHL and NHL are just two different levels. The Chicago Wolves, Atlanta's AHL affilate, won the Calder Cup last year, which is the AHL's championship. The Thrashers, well, are still trying to get out of the tank.

I think that the fact about team sharing vs. playoffs is mostly conicidental. Just a theory.

[Greensboro Hurricanes]

This probably spells the end of the Hurricanes-style Lowell jerseys.

That's a shame, because they looked good.

[Captain Slack]

This probably spells the end of the Hurricanes-style Lowell jerseys.

That's a shame, because they looked good.

Hope not! But if so, maybe we'll be able to get some on E-bay now.

[Jillsdad]

I hate to dredge up a really old topic but if we are sharing the team with Calgary how does that work for players we have under contract like Malec? Can Calgary call him up or can they only call up players that they have under contract? Once again sorry to dredge up old stuff but i was curious

[Shell]

I'm under the impression that our players are ours and their players are theirs, and there is no sharing in regards to call-ups. They have their 8 skaters and goalie, as do we and they are separate.. until game time. I have heard it can be confusing for the kids though if tehre are two different coaching styles going at once. :crazy:

[MoBigRed]

I hate to dredge up a really old topic but if we are sharing the team with Calgary how does that work for players we have under contract like Malec? Can Calgary call him up or can they only call up players that they have under contract?


It would really kinda suck for the Hurricanes to be paying Malec' salary while he's lighting it up in Calgary, no?

The Hurricanes and the Flames share a farm club - they have not merged. The Hurricanes pay Malec' salary; therefore the only team that can call up Malec is the Hurricanes.

[Shell]

off-topic - but damn, long time no see Mo! How the hell are ya?

[StormShaman]

I hate to dredge up a really old topic but if we are sharing the team with Calgary how does that work for players we have under contract like Malec? Can Calgary call him up or can they only call up players that they have under contract?


It would really kinda suck for the Hurricanes to be paying Malec' salary while he's lighting it up in Calgary, no?

The Hurricanes and the Flames share a farm club - they have not merged. The Hurricanes pay Malec' salary; therefore the only team that can call up Malec is the Hurricanes.

Wasn't this already addressed in another thread? Or am I senile?

[MoBigRed]

Wasn't this already addressed in another thread? Or am I senile?


It's even closer to home than that - it was addressed in this same exact thread, a few posts up. We just wanted to remind everyone...


off-topic - but damn, long time no see Mo! How the hell are ya?


Can't complain too much. Work, play, the usual stuff. Heading out on vacation tomorrow, though, so i won't be around for a while. Hope all's well with everyone!

[ontheboards]

What is the Hurricane's connection with the Calgary organization? Is Rutherford tight with that franchise and WHY? The Hurricanes seemed to have buddied up with the Flames rather tightly-- we gave them Malik and Gelinas (just felt like it!), we get Boughner (someone with talent and a fan favorite) for a trade pick, and we now share the Loch Monsters... I thought our real trading pipeline was with the Flyers but it now seems to be Calgary...

[stewart123]

As a certain member of the board will attest, Malik went to Vancouver.

So the only links are the free agency of Gelinas, (which only counts if he spoke with Calgary management about the state of the Hurricanes and those talks led to further contact), the sharing of Lowell, and the trade of Boughner.

I think the sharing of Lowell is directly related to the similar financial state of both franchises. The Canes payroll last year was $36 million, the Flames payroll was $32.6 million. The Canes averaged 15,595 the past two seasons, the Flames, 15,979. Calgary needed a replacement for their bankrupt farm club, Carolina doesn't have enough top-flight prospects at the moment to fill a roster. Both teams get to have lower operating expenses while keeping 8 skaters and a goalie ready for evaluation and call-up.

Boughner may certainly be related to the sharing of Lowell, and the increased discussion that took place, as I'm shocked there weren't other teams willing to offer more than a 4th round pick for a quality captain-level defenseman. I suppose we'll see, but with the history of our 'relationship' with Philadelphia and Phoenix, I'm quite happy to find a new trading partner.